Why should you tip? It is amazing how often this question is asked and debated. To me the answer is painfully obvious. When someone asks me why people should tip, I answer their question with a few of my own. Do you want hot food? Do you want your drink refilled? Do you want the person taking your order to care about the quality of food you are going to eat? The answer to these questions is always yes. So why would a person that is getting paid hourly whether you eat there or not care about any of those things if there is nothing extra in it for them? The acronym T.I.P.S. has been said to stand for: Tipping Insures Prompt (or Proper) Service. The argument above is usually very hard to argue against because there is no doubt that servers give good service based on what they perceive to be a carrot on the end of a stick. They will work hard for you and you will reward them at the end for a job well done. So to me, the question is not really to tip or not, but rather how much to tip.
Tipping standards vary greatly from region to region and country to country. To complicate matters, tipping standards change over time and what services require a tip also change. Back in high school I had a friend who believed that tipping on drinks was not necessary. I never did figure out his logic on that one but it does go to show that there are many ideas about tipping.
When figuring your tip, you should consider the following circumstances that may or may not apply to the server depending on which state you are in.
* Hourly wages are typically significantly less in the service industry, because tips are considered part of the servers income.
* Your server does pay income taxes. In absence of proper documentation of tips, the government will look at the servers food and beverage sales and base their taxable tip income on a percent of it. So if you do not tip the server, it has actually cost the server money to serve you. See the IRS tipping tax laws.
* Believe it or not, servers do not always get a paycheck. Sometimes, because of the taxes they pay and/or deductions, servers must pay in additional money to cover the taxes rather than get a check.
* Your server has to tip too. It is very common for a waiter or waitress to have to tip out their supporting staff, ie; the bartender, buss person, food runners and others. Bartenders may have to tip out their bar backs. These tips are based often on the sales of the server, so if you don’t tip them, in addition to the 8% the government gets they often have to shell out money to the support staff putting them further in the hole. Sometimes the support staff is tipped a percent of the servers tips. So not tipping the server is the same as not tipping any of the hard working support staff in the restaurant.
* Servers do a lot of work that they are not tipped on also. It is called side work and it is work that is done for no more than their hourly rate. Side work usually involves cleaning the restaurant, stocking supplies and getting the store ready for the next shifts business. Side work can be time consuming and at times physically straining.
The most common argument (and frankly the most annoying and ignorant) against tipping is that by not tipping you are “helping” the servers cause for better hourly rates. For starters, hurting one server here and there on any given day is not going to further any cause. Second there is no cause. Most servers do not rely on their hourly income. Serving is hard, fast paced work. Servers can earn a good living from the tips they get. If servers were going to work for a strictly hourly rate, I can assure you that rate would be high. If the hourly rate were high, guess what would happen to the prices you pay when you go out to eat or drink? That money would have to come from somewhere.
Do you legally have to tip? No. Occasionally, you will have a situation where gratuity has been automatically added to your bill. This is usually on larger groups or parties. This gratuity has been added because it is easy for the server to get a tip that is far less than they deserve, because in a group setting it is easy for one or two people to under pay causing the rest of the group to fall short. Again, you do not legally have to pay this gratuity, but if you don’t you should have a talk with the server and/or manager and explain why. Remember, just because a gratuity has been added, it may still be less than a good tip for the server. For example, a gratuity may have been added at 15%. This is a tip for average service. If your server did a great job it is good to add in the difference to make up to 20% or more. Many times the server had to give up several other smaller tables to take your party, so even with automatic gratuity they end up making less on their shift.
After all that, why do servers do it? Well in the end, there are enough people out there that understand that a good tip is a kind reward for a job well done. And waiting tables can be quite profitable. It is no surprise that the most financially successful servers are typically the most friendly, efficient and entertaining. These servers are rewarded for exhibiting those behaviors. And we all want to encourage those behaviors. Don’t we?
Revised 11/2/2009
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November 22nd, 2007 | 
So if you receive poor service, and you leave no tip, or a small tip, do you really think that actually encourages the server to do better next time? They’ll just think you’re cheap.
Conversely, if you leave a tip, because that is expected, or because they get a low hourly wage etc., you are encouraging more of the same poor service.
John,
“So if you receive poor service, and you leave no tip, or a small tip, do you really think that actually encourages the server to do better next time? They’ll just think you’re cheap.”
I can see where one could draw that conclusion, but I definitely think a server knows when that have really F’d up. If they think you’re cheap, they ARE F’d up.
“Conversely, if you leave a tip, because that is expected, or because they get a low hourly wage etc., you are encouraging more of the same poor service.”
You simply shouldn’t tip (or tip less) if you receive poor service. It’s that simple. You should not encourage poor service. Like anything else, lack of income will weed out the bad servers. I believe most servers would agree that you should not just tip normal on poor service.
Tip great for great service – tip bad for bad service. Simple.
This is the most ridiculous article I have ever read. Your manager is paying you a wage, Mr. Server. If you don’t like your wage, then quit your job. It’s simple. I shouldn’t have to pay extra money for an already over-priced meal, no matter how convincing your friendly attitude was, just because your job sucks. Cry more.
Freddy,
You don’t have to eat out. There are things called grocery stores everywhere. Your meals will be at cost and you don’t have to tip. Sounds like a perfect world for you.
Oh My…
Whilst I admire your passion on the subject I’m afraid I completely disagree.
You pose the question, “Why should you tip?”. The answer is painful and obvious:
~ “Do you want hot food?” Look next to the menu and you will see a price. This is what you pay to be served hot food. With your logic you should be tipping the chef, waiter, manager, cleaners, accountant etc. as they all have an important role in the restaraunt you are dining in.
~ “Do you want your drink refilled?” Again, you pay for this. The drink and service.
~ “Do you want the person taking your order to care about the quality of food you are going to eat?” You should not be expected to pay someone to care about the service they are giving you. Imagine if a binman came to collect your rubbish and did it well… would you tip them? Put it this way, if they came to collect it, emptied it on your front door and shouted abuse at you would you complain to someone in a higher position that they had not done their job in a professional manor? I think that’s a no-brainer.
~ “So why would a person that is getting paid hourly whether you eat there or not care about any of those things if there is nothing extra in it for them?” With that theory, anyone that is working on an hourly wage (which is many people in many professions who don’t get tipped) is justified to not do their job properly unless tipped? If everyone was tipped then that’s all you would do all day, every day, it would be pointless.
~ “T.I.P.S. – Tipping Insures Prompt (or Proper) Service” This definition is a myth.
~ “Hourly wages are typically significantly less in the service industry, because tips are considered part of the servers income.” Wages are low in many sectors. This statement doesn’t make sense – Are you saying you should tip people if they are on a low wage? Next time you are in Spar, would you tip the shelf stacker for stacking the bread in an orderly fashion?
~ “Your server does pay income taxes. In absence of proper documentation of tips, the government will look at the servers food and beverage sales and base their taxable tip income on a percent of it.” Employers should sort this out surely? Sounds Illegal, can it not be reported. If not, shouldn’t the government be lobbied about this? Again, a poor excuse to tip.
~ “Believe it or not, servers do not always get a paycheck. Sometimes, because of the taxes they pay and/or deductions, servers must pay in to the company rather than get a check.” This is garbage, people get paid to work. Witholding staff’s salaries is against the law. “Pay into the company?” What exactly?
~ “Your server has to tip too.” No one HAS TO tip. If no one tipped they wouldn’t either. You should choose to tip!
~ “Servers do a lot of work that they are not tipped on also.” Hmm… are you by any chance a waiter? In case your not, a waiter/server has many responsibilities. Serving customers is just one of those. So we should tip for a server for putting a menue on the table… this is getting a bit out of hand.
~ “The most common argument (and frankly the most annoying and ignorant) against tipping is that by not tipping you are “helping” the servers cause for better hourly rates. For starters, hurting one server here and there on any given day is not going to further any cause.” It is a known fact that many employers top up staff wages to the National Minimum Wage by using “their” tips. If anything, the people who DO tip are hurting servers chances of better pay. Tipping also gives servers erratic pay no matter how they serve, as tipping amounts differ from person to person.
To my knowledge, tips were introduced many centuries ago and has since developed into this hideous awkward social-enforced habbit. Changing over the years from…
If a server gave you service above what was expected (or you just wanted to) you could give them a “tip”/enough money to buy a drink and the end of their shift. That is in my mind what a tip is.
not…
A percentage of the bill for a meal. Which in many cases doesn’t go to the person who gave you that great service. The arguements to tip this modern-way is an insult to the customer, staff and workers in sectors that are non-tip-zones. Firemen, Teachers, Doctors, Police… In fact it is illegal to tip government/council employees. It is seen as bribery in the eyes of the law!
~ “Do you want hot food?” Look next to the menu and you will see a price. This is what you pay to be served hot food. With your logic you should be tipping the chef, waiter, manager, cleaners, accountant etc. as they all have an important role in the restaraunt you are dining in.
**No, this is the price of the food that will be brought to you. If it is not to your satisfaction you can take it up with the management. But if I were you, I would want to make sure that the employee bringing it to me made sure it was safe, hot and good. Not just delivered in what-ever condition. You take a lot for granted about the service and food industry.
~ “Do you want your drink refilled?” Again, you pay for this. The drink and service.
** If and when I get to it then, if that’s your attitude.
~ “Do you want the person taking your order to care about the quality of food you are going to eat?” You should not be expected to pay someone to care about the service they are giving you. Imagine if a binman came to collect your rubbish and did it well… would you tip them? Put it this way, if they came to collect it, emptied it on your front door and shouted abuse at you would you complain to someone in a higher position that they had not done their job in a professional manor? I think that’s a no-brainer.
** Yeah, I would complain. They are paid to take the trash. Not dump it on my step. Also they are paid much more than server minimum wage. plus, I don’t eat garbage.
~ “So why would a person that is getting paid hourly whether you eat there or not care about any of those things if there is nothing extra in it for them?” With that theory, anyone that is working on an hourly wage (which is many people in many professions who don’t get tipped) is justified to not do their job properly unless tipped? If everyone was tipped then that’s all you would do all day, every day, it would be pointless.
** Nope, wrong again. We are talking about the SERVICE industry. Not construction, not garbage collection, not rocket science. You are tipping on the SERVICE you get. That is the whole point. If you want shitty service and live in a world where that is the norm, fine keep propagating the problem. Eventually you will either pay a lot more for food or service will suck. Just a watch and see.
~ “T.I.P.S. – Tipping Insures Prompt (or Proper) Service” This definition is a myth.
** Agreed the etymology is questionable… Still, not a bad acronym.
~ “Hourly wages are typically significantly less in the service industry, because tips are considered part of the servers income.” Wages are low in many sectors. This statement doesn’t make sense – Are you saying you should tip people if they are on a low wage? Next time you are in Spar, would you tip the shelf stacker for stacking the bread in an orderly fashion?
** Again, not a service to ME. Why would I tip? I don’t give a shit if it is stacked in an orderly fashion or not. If the bread is brought to me to eat, I’d like to ensure that it has been well taken care of by the SERVER, so I would tip.
~ “Your server does pay income taxes. In absence of proper documentation of tips, the government will look at the servers food and beverage sales and base their taxable tip income on a percent of it.” Employers should sort this out surely? Sounds Illegal, can it not be reported. If not, shouldn’t the government be lobbied about this? Again, a poor excuse to tip.
** Servers ARE responsible for the money they make legally, just like everyone else. The way the system is, if you choose not to tip, the server has to pay the Government to serve you, because their taxes are based on THEIR sales, not the restaurants. If you don’t like that, take it up with your representative, don’t blame the server.
~ “Believe it or not, servers do not always get a paycheck. Sometimes, because of the taxes they pay and/or deductions, servers must pay in to the company rather than get a check.” This is garbage, people get paid to work. Witholding staff’s salaries is against the law. “Pay into the company?” What exactly?
** This was poorly stated in the article, but the point is the TAX withholding and other deductions can amount to more than the hourly rate if the server make exceptional tips.
~ “Your server has to tip too.” No one HAS TO tip. If no one tipped they wouldn’t either. You should choose to tip!
** Yes and no. It may be unspoken but if you choose not to tip the support staff in most places you will be “run out on a rail”, hours will be cut and you will be essentially exiled at the restaurant.
~ “Servers do a lot of work that they are not tipped on also.” Hmm… are you by any chance a waiter? In case your not, a waiter/server has many responsibilities. Serving customers is just one of those. So we should tip for a server for putting a menue on the table… this is getting a bit out of hand.
** You have never hmmmm… been a waiter – obviously – it’s all part of the job. It has been said a thousand times, if you don’t like tipping, don’t go out to eat. You obviously have zero appreciation of what goes into putting a good, hot, safe, fresh quality meal on the table in a restaurant. So shallow it’s sad.
~ “The most common argument (and frankly the most annoying and ignorant) against tipping is that by not tipping you are “helping” the servers cause for better hourly rates. For starters, hurting one server here and there on any given day is not going to further any cause.” It is a known fact that many employers top up staff wages to the National Minimum Wage by using “their” tips. If anything, the people who DO tip are hurting servers chances of better pay. Tipping also gives servers erratic pay no matter how they serve, as tipping amounts differ from person to person.
** I don’t know. This doesn’t make much sense to me. Most servers I know like working for tips. Precious few employers pay more than they have to and there is probably a reason if they do. It is definitely the exception to the rule.
To my knowledge, tips were introduced many centuries ago and has since developed into this hideous awkward social-enforced habbit. Changing over the years from…
If a server gave you service above what was expected (or you just wanted to) you could give them a “tip”/enough money to buy a drink and the end of their shift. That is in my mind what a tip is.
**It’s nostalgic, but no longer reality.
not…
A percentage of the bill for a meal. Which in many cases doesn’t go to the person who gave you that great service. The arguements to tip this modern-way is an insult to the customer, staff and workers in sectors that are non-tip-zones. Firemen, Teachers, Doctors, Police… In fact it is illegal to tip government/council employees. It is seen as bribery in the eyes of the law!
** Don’t see the correlation between firemen and servers. Servers deliver you food and the better quality service the more thankful you should be. A fireman’s job is to put out fires and save lives. There is no gray area there. Government?council people should be put out of work if they suck at what they do. A server that makes no tips will be put out of work automatically. No one would do that job long for minimum wage or less. I agree that a percentage of the meal is arbitrary and I don’t care for that method of calculation, but it is the easiest standard to go by.
I appreciate your thoughts on this topic and I’m glad you cared enough to speak. That’s what makes this country great (while it lasts) You are just missing the whole point of the article.
Tipping is a moronic dying social convention that I refuse to prop up. In no other industry are we expected to pay people for doing the jobs that they were contracted to do by their employers. This argument that we should tip to avoid getting our food spit on is vile and extortionary. Thank God the rest of the world has moved away from this primitive remnant of the 17th century… here’s hoping America will join them soon.
Where the hell did you the idea tips were to avoid getting your food spit on? I don’t think anyone has said that.
whatever.
you’re an idiot if you’re foolish enough to be goaded into leaving a tip… the practice is arbitrary and should be abolished.
hey dude! that waitress really likes you!
http://www.tippingsucks.com
To Dan or whoever may agree with him:
“T.I.P.S. – Tipping Insures Prompt (or Proper) Service” This definition is a myth.”–T.I.P.S stands for To Insure Proper Service. As a server I firmly believe you should get tipped on proper service. I’ve worked with plenty of people who didnt deserve the tip they got and its ridiculous. However, if you get great service why shouldn’t you leave a tip?
“Believe it or not, servers do not always get a paycheck. Sometimes, because of the taxes they pay and/or deductions, servers must pay in to the company rather than get a check.” This is garbage, people get paid to work. Witholding staff’s salaries is against the law. “Pay into the company?” What exactly?”—In Ohio we get paid 3.65/hr. We see that in our paychecks however we have to claim at least 10% of our sales(not tips) and that gets taxed too. If we dont work enough hours to cover the taxes being taken out then it becomes a negative figure and we have to pay the difference.
“Your server has to tip too.” No one HAS TO tip. If no one tipped they wouldn’t either. You should choose to tip—Based on our sales, we have to tip 1% to the bartenders, 1.5% to the server assistants(hosts, bussers) and $1 to the food runner for every hour they’ve worked. This usually comes out to about 20-25 dollars on a friday/saturday shift. And these tip-outs are mandatory regardless of whether you made enough money that night.
And to say that a tip should be enough so they can grab a drink after work? I have a 2 year old daughter that I solely support and go to school full time. Serving is the only job possible right now with enough flexibility. Try raising a toddler on a $2 tip. Or even getting enough gas in your car to make it to work. Tipping is an Americn custom. One of which we’re never going to escape regardless of whether you like it or not. And if you dont agree with it then dont go out to eat, at least not at a full service restaurant.
Why should you tip?
Tipping is a socially implemented system to give incentive to people in the service industry to provide you with above average service. If you are one of these douchebags who think \"I am paying for my meal therefore I shouldn\’t have to tip\" then you should just let your server know that you do not plan to tip ahead of time so they can provide you with the minimal service you deserve. You should also visit a country (like the U.K.) to see exactly what type of shitty service you receive when gratuity is already added to your check.
The truth is:
- You know that you are expected to tip.
- You acknowledge this fact by arguing reasons why you shouldn\’t have to tip – acknowledging the fact that tipping is customary.
- You argue against it as a means to justify your rude, cheap, and unacceptable behavior.
- Servers know when they have provided you with good service and you stiff them solely because you are a cheap asshole. We are well aware of when we slack or screw something up. It does not upset us when you stiff us if the service was bad. When we give good service we expect a tip because that is the social contract that you entered when your fat, cheap ass sat in our station and ran us back and forth for free refills and 15 sides of ranch dressing.
FYI: My manager pays me well above minimum wage and when I claim all the tips I make, my check is still $50 a week.
Also, people who say \"there is no other industry where tipping is expected\" is full of shit. Incentives in other fields are very similar, except companies just charge you more without asking (regardless of your level of happiness). How do you think executives get bonuses and salespeople make commission?
I love when people\’s solution to this questions ends with \"If you don\’t like it find another job.\" This just shows what a stupid mindless piece of shit you really are. This shows your complete and total lack of respect for people in the industry. These people always act like waiting tables or tending bar is beneath them. The truth is that most of the people I wait on are nice and tip me generously.
Very few people share your sentiments with tipping. Most of them appreciate the good service I provide and tip me accordingly. Those who don\’t I know are just assholes who probably don\’t appreciate anyone or anything.
My husband and I enjoy eating at restaurants and we usually tip between $10-$15 (more for better service, less for worse) regardless of the bill amount (which is usually $30 or $40) I tip because my dad always tipped big and I feel that it would be rude not to. (Unless the service was extremely awful) Reading this article is beginning to change my mind on the subject. I strongly dislike being EXPECTED to tip in order to get good service. Good service should be there regardless of a tip. A tip should not be an incentive. And if it were to be an incentive, it should be applied everywhere, not just to waiters. I, as a dispatcher, should be tipped when I’m extra nice to a customer over the phone, right? I don’t get paid as well as I want to, so gimme a tip! That said, I’d like to reiterate, I tip because I want to and I’d hate to be expected to tip (it ruins it for me.)
Tipping is very important to the server. When I get a pay check from my manager, you know what it says every time? VOID. In big bold letters. Servers get paid 2.13 an hour and all of it goes to taxes!! The only money we make, THE ONLY MONEY, are the tips we receive from the people we wait on. And if we give poor service, drinks not refilled, not attentive, etc. not leaving a tip IS NOT the right thing to do. Instead leave the minimum 10% for lunch and 15% for dinner. Times are hard right now for all of us and if people can afford to go out and eat, they should be able to afford a tip.
I work and have worked in the restaurant industry for years. I am in management now and have been for some time. I will say this, tipping is not and should not be optional. When the restaurant industry as a whole decides to outlaw tipping and increase prices across the board by 20%, then tipping will be optional. Until then, it is as important as any social norm of etiquette that you would be expected to follow if you want to be treated as a normal human being in civilized society. As a manager, if you don’t tip or tip like a cheap ass once, shame on you (barring bad service, of course) But then again, I only hire good servers so that is RARELY the case. And how do I attract these good servers? The money they make for doing a great job and waiting on people who for the most part get the correlation. But, I digress. If you tip like a cheap ass twice or 3 times and I catch a pattern, I will add gratuity to you table just in case you need a little help with your manners. If you refuse to pay it or have a fit about it, you will be asked not to return to my restaurant. You don’t think you have to tip? Fine. You also can go dine somewhere else. Maybe somewhere the service sucks because they get a lot of people like you. Sounds like a good match to me.
If you dont have the money to tip, then you shouldnt go out to eat at a sit down restaurant. Order it to go, get take out, or go to a drive-thru. Being at a restaurant is not just about the food, its about the experience of being out of your house and eating good food. i am a server and here is what i go by: if you leave a bad tip or no tip at all (b/c you believe tipping is not something you should do) regardless of the good service i provide you, then i WILL remember it. and then next time you come in, and i am the server, again, you better believe i will not refill you drink, i will not be nice or personable, and your food will probably wait in the window just a little bit longer than before. because that it the caliber of service you are tipping for. the price on the menu is the price of the food, not the service. so a tip should be required for good service. if you dont feel that way, then you should make your own meals or serve yourself at a buffet.
First off, I’m a good tipper. I generally tip 20% or more. I used to bag groceries when I was in high school for tips only. We didn’t get an hourly wage and worked for tips only. I still know people that do it and I know people in the food service industry, so I usually tip well.
I work abroad. Currently, I work in Russia where tipping is somewhat frowned upon. The workers over here are paid fairly for the work they do. Austrailians I work with tell me that 10% is their standard. Same deal, they actually get paid a decent wage and tipping is just a gratuity to show appreciation.
I’ve been having a lot of discussion lately about tipping and I’m starting to hate it. I still do it, but I hate it. Here’s why:
An employer who pays their employees less than minimum wage because they factor in tips is just wrong. That means they are passing their employees salaries onto the customer. I don’t agree with that.
I don’t like percentage tipping (even though I still do it). If I go out to an expensive restaurant and have shitty service I’m expected to tip more to the server than if I went to cheap restaurant and had great service. If I take my family out to eat for $200, I’m supposed to tip $30-$40. If I take them out for $100 then it’s half that, even if it’s the same amount of time spent in the restaurant, same service and same quality.
I’ve seen arguments for tipping counter service, like Starbucks. Why is it you have to tip bartenders and not the hot dog vendor? I tip bartenders the same amount every time, regardless of the amount spent. If I get one beer, I tip one dollar. If I get two beers, I tip one dollar. If it’s a large order, I will tip more. I don’t see the relation to money spent in a bar to the amount I should tip. If I get 5 beers @ $25 I’m not going to tip $5. It takes them a couple more seconds to pop the tops off 4 more beers.
If we’re expected to pay for service, the restaurants should do away with hourly wages all together. They should say “Here is the menu, if you want someone to bring the food out to you and refill your drink, it will cost you $X amount.”
I still tip, but I’m starting to hate it. When I was in high school and went out to a burger joint it was common for all of us to throw in $2, regardless of what we ordered. Now it seems like the tipping standard just keeps going up. I don’t blame the servers, I blame the employers for expecting us to tip so much.
As a former waiter who used to suck at tipping (before I got into the service industry), I know how much tipping is important to us waiters. I suggest to every one of you who complained about having to tip on top of an expensive meal to either stay home and cook for yourself and serve yourself, or go find a summer job as a waiter and try it out. YOU WILL LEARN SO MUCH about the service industry that you don’t know about as an outsider (patron). When I became a waiter myself, I had no idea why tipping was important and all the hard work involved. Listen, I have worked MANY customer service jobs in my lifetime, from phones to reception to cashier to retail, but nothing compares to waiting tables! I refuse to ever do it again. 5 years was enough! It’s not easy. There is a reason why waiters’ shelf life is short (I have never heard of a career waiter because most waiters I knew left after a couple of years, because it’s EXHAUSTING!) So far I have heard so many arguments against tipping and the one that stuck out at me the most was the argument that no other industry who does similar work gets tips, so why should waiters. One person mentioned garbage collectors (wtf!) and another mentioned answering phones and that they provide great customer service because it’s REQUIRED, which is correct. If a garbage person leaves a mess consistently when picking up your garbage and you then have to pick up after them, then you can call to complain about a bad job done. Same for a receptionist who does an awful job, you can complain to a supervisor next time you call (if you can get their badge number). But I just don’t see similarities between being a receptionist and a waiter. A server is consistently “slaving” (for lack of a better word) for you; refilling your drinks, getting you more bread, making your drink (yes, in my restaurant, I wore many hats; waiter, bartender and food runner) and attending to your needs. If I went to Walmart and asked a customer service person to not only push my cart for me around the store but to grab the items off the shelf for me, read the food labels to me, scratch my ass too, then THAT is a SERVICE (unless you are blind or handicapped, then it’s a courtesy). That’s why when you shop at Walmart or any store, you do these things on your own, right? – otherwise you’d tip them. (hence why you tip bagger that bring your groceries to your car!) I mean, it’s just common sense. A grocery bagger DOES NOT have to bag them and follow you to your car while you yap away on your cellphone and then demands that you put them in his/her car and drive away. That is an EXTRA. They are there to occasionally help you find something, but that’s it; not to be your personal shopper! If you don’t feel like cooking one evening (everyone knows that cooking for oneself can be very time consuming) and don’t feel like getting up from the table to refill your drink and also want to experience a great ambience, alone or with friends, that you CAN’T get staying at home, then YOU ARE EXPECTED to appreciate the SERVERS that wait on you hand and foot and you appreciate their service by tipping them. Any idiot knows that if servers were actually paid 15 dollars an hour, then your steak and potatoes that costs 10 dollars would then cost 20, ok? It’s got to come out of somewhere!!! Hellooooooo! I honestly do believe that if servers were paid an actual consistent salary (as some of you have suggested), service would suck even more than it occasionally does now. I eat out a lot and it’s very rare that the server sucks at being attentive to my needs. And when they suck, I will tip them a lot less and I WILL TELL THEM WHY. You betcha! That way they LEARN to be a better waiter, instead of assuming that I am cheap. Next time, they will think twice about chatting up their coworkers too long or bullshitting instead of being attentive. Because if I wanted to keep getting up to refill my drink or get my own silverware, and clear away my table, I CAN DO THAT AT HOME! I am starting to think that maybe ALL THE CUSTOMER SERVICE job salaries should be tip-based. That will show ‘em! Next time I go to Walmart and I am standing there on line and they are ignoring me, it will reflect in their next pay check. Or next time I go to check out and the cashier is snobby and unfriendly, it will also reflect in their paychecks! I know that as a server it IS MY JOB to be polite and give good service but I hate to admit it… when there is an incentive to give not only “basic” service but EXCELLENT service, you WILL provide over-the-top service and bust your ass running around to make sure your tables are ok. I mean, when employees at Walmart that see me walking in and decide still to make me wait an extra minute to acknowledge me knowing they are still going to get paid 7.50 an hour, they won’t give me that extra special service. The golden carrot at the end of the stick isn’t there to give them incentive. On a final note, I highly recommend anyone who has had bad service to not be afraid to vent with the waiter or talk to the manager about your experience. There is nothing more frustrating than doing an awesome job, constantly refilling someone’s table, asking how they are doing, providing a smile everytime and then realize you were stiffed out of a tip! People, please don’t take it out on the waiter if you are one of those who believe restaurants who pay their servers higher wages. It’s not the server’s fault. Take it out with the restaurant or your legislators. Or just stay home. Plain and simple. You can buy a six-pack for a lot cheaper and stay home or go out and pay 4 bucks for a beer and enjoy the company of people, the good music, conversation from the bartender and patrons, etc. It’s the ambience and service you are paying EXTRA for. If you are too cheap to go out to eat, there is always McDonald’s…. and you can refill your own drink!
Ok…I have worked in the service industry for 30+ years. It has afforded me a decent living, but by no means, will I ever become rich in the business. Waiting tables is a job that requires an extreme amount of organizational skills, tons of patience, an outgoing personality, and true care about your job. To the people who think tipping isn’t necessary, trust me when I say that if you frequent the same restaurant, you WILL be remembered, and you will get the service according to your tip. Servers have no authority over what the price of a meal costs, however, you should remember that included in this price is the cost of everything that goes into making the meal. Cooks and dishwashers have to be paid, as well as busboys, utilities, linens for tables, etc. Going out to eat is a luxury, just as being served is. If you don’t want to tip, stay home, cook yourself, buy your own groceries, wash your own dishes, and serve your own plate of food.
I provide my customers with excellent service, above and beyond the call of duty. I’m friendly, helpful, and do the best possible job for them. Occasionally, I have the misfortune of getting a party of people who expect to be served like kings and queens, which they are, and don’t appreciate what they get, leaving a tip that’s less than protical. I do remember their faces, and the next time they are seated at my table, they get what they pay for. I simply chalk it up to ignorance of the customer.
Should there be an occasion when I give less than great service, I don’t expect a decent tip. Also, when I receive my paycheck at the end of the week, it’s for the amount of $0.00, because I have to report everything I make. The hourly wage of $2.50 that I’m paid by my company is all taken up by taxes.
Be good to your server, and it will be returned to you 10 fold.
Freddy wrote:
September 15th, 2009 at 2:00 am
This is the most ridiculous article I have ever read. Your manager is paying you a wage, Mr. Server. If you don’t like your wage, then quit your job. It’s simple. I shouldn’t have to pay extra money for an already over-priced meal, no matter how convincing your friendly attitude was, just because your job sucks. Cry more.
FREDDY: serving does not suck… and do you know that most servers make 2.13 an hour.. THAT is the FEDERAL minimum wage for servers. I as a server make about 800-1000$ a week. do you? my job does not suck, but it is part of dining out. If you can’t afford to pay for service then DON’T go out to a restaurant to eat.
Tipping is for suckers! That is why you should move to a country that does not tip, like Japan. Prompt, polite (sometimes overly), and accurate service that is comparable to costs in america. The only difference is that the waiters in Japan make about 10.00 an hour and only pay a 6% tax to the government.
FYI: In lots of places servers do in fact make more than minimum wage. For instance, union servers in Vegas make $11.50 an hour. I WOULD NOT wait tables for a mere $11.50 an hour though – even if I kept every penny of it. In tips, I easily make triple that per hour.
Waiting tables only sucks if you have to wait on douchebags like Freddy & James. Most people have the common courtesy and decency to tip because they know that not tipping simply because you don’t feel like it is simply a dick move. Everyone knows that tipping is expected so if you fail to do so once you have been provided with good service you are simply a scumbag loser who is pretty much stealing from the waitstaff.
From what I have read, the main arguement for tipping is that it is for the service and if you don’t like it, eat home. Now I understand that point but I’m coming from a completely different industry and that is retail. In retail we service the customer with tasks that are far more confidential than “hot food” and tips in our jobs can get you fired. I am a manager for a large retail chain and worked my way up and here is what I see. If I help a customer lift a 50 inch tv into their car without scratching their car and making sure I don’t mess up the tv…I don’t get a tip…that’s a service but if I accept a tip…I will be fired. How about best buy geek squad…you are dealing with sensitive information that people are putting in ur hands. They ensure you have your files and things u need…they are NOT allowed tips for their service…they will be fired for it. I damn well expect someone to work on my computer with care and respectfulness…though I do not need it personally that is the outlook I have.
So these non food industry services aren’t tipped but I think are equal if not more important than hot food.
Now the point of tips cause you do not get paid enough well it is the choice YOU make. I am not forcing u to be a server nor am I telling u living off tips is wrong but it is UR choice to be in that profession and if you don’t get tipped well…you should look internally at the choice you made for a profession. If you make good money…rock out congrats…I prefer my salaried check every week knowing exactly how much I make and not worrying what ill be getting paid based on others rather than my employer.
Side note – I tip but don’t like people saying they deserve it…sorry no one deserves anything.it is about the choices you make
Excuse me! I am no douche-bag, that would be the manager or owner of the establishments in question. I never said I didn’t tip when I lived in America, I only saId it is advisable to live in a country that doesn’t tip. When I go back to the US I still tip even now though I can’t help but feel cheated since I am paying more and more than is listed. Why is it that every other country requires these costs in print so you pay the price you see? Seems like America needs to change it’s policies so we don’t feel so ripped every time! Even at the grocery store, you add up the costs you see on the labels and get to the register then you find out the tax. So stupid!
Would consumers prefer an automatic 20% additional fee on their bill? -or- would you rather keep it optional and based on performance? Just food for thought. (pun kind-of intended.)
Would it not weed out the people who would be stingy otherwise since it is already there? And like earlier stated…some places do that already either on customer size (amount of people) or whatever it may be
James: I’ve been to countries where the gratuity is added to the check automatically. The service sucked at every single place. The gratuity that was added was still only 12% or so – not enough for a person to reasonably live on. If the tipping system were remodeled to include 20% on each check then a lot of cheap people would just stay home or eat fast food. That would be fine by me but inevitably these people would call corporate offices to complain and change the system back so they can continue to be cheap dicks.
The conversation would go as follows:
Corporate: “I’m sorry that is our new policy because some people didn’t like the old system.”
Cheap asshole: “Well I don’t like the new system. I feel I am being penalized for other people’s actions. I want the old system back.”
Each corporation would cave because they are tired of hearing people bitch and those cheap assholes that called to complain (who were the problem to begin with) will go back to being shitty tippers or non-tippers.
The main argument for tipping in the first place is that it is a socially subscribed to system that gives incentive to servers to do a job that is above average. If gratuity is automatically added to each check then servers (not all but most) tend to lose interest to go above and beyond. Instead they will provide average service at best. If you think we feel a sense of entitlement when we do a good job and a guest even says “the service was phenomenal,” then you’re right. That is the system and if you are aware of THE TIPPING SYSTEM and you simply say “I don’t care, I don’t like the system, I will do whatever I want” then you are the problem not the solution.
As for people who argue that retailers aren’t allowed to accept tips there is also a reason for that. Retailers who accept cash from people might be doing it for either free merchandise or merchandise at a reduced rate (paying for a lower priced item and receiving a higher priced one for instance). The reason you can’t accept tips is because the corporation that you work for doesn’t want to encourage theft. Instead, retailers promote good service by offering other incentives – commission, profit sharing, bonuses etc. Also, you are not labeled by the federal government as working in a tipped position which means there isn’t a way for you or your employer to claim these tips as income. The comparison isn’t even remotely valid.
Also, if you can’t afford to tip then you really can’t afford to eat out. If your money is stretched so thin that an extra $5 per person is going to break the bank then you really need to learn how to live within your means.
wow. I really can’t believe the arguments that servers leave in their own defense. You carry things. All day long you carry things from one spot to another. I ask you for something and you carry my order to a person who actually cooks it and then you carry that back to me. If I want a drink you tell a bartender who makes it and then you carry it back to me. You stop me from walking is all you do. If you can carry things to me in a polite fashion you get twenty percent or more of the total of my bill. How can you even begin to have an argument for always getting a tip? You walk from point a to point b! Get over yourselves. Anyone and I mean anyone can do your job that is why you get paid so little by your company. You are expendable. If they can ever get a cheap automated way to replace you they will. How low and lazy are you to try to guilt someone into tipping you when you can\\\’t even carry something well. When you have grown up and see how the real world works and how real jobs expect you to perform you will look back and wish you could go back to that job.
In no area of retail should the ‘true’ cost of goods or services be ‘hidden’ or masked from the buyer. I pay a price that is intended to cover the cost of goods sold (or service), cost of delivery, all overheads, etc. etc. I see a price on a shelf and I pay it – and I get what I pay for. If it isn’t what was promised, I can get a refund or ask for a discount. But everybody knows up front the total costs/margins/profits.
So – yes; I believe restaurant prices should cover the full and proper cost of delivering the food AND service – probably around 15% increase (as it will no longer have to cover the ‘cheapskates’ who don’t leave tips). Note that this is an increase in base prices and NOT a ‘service charge’. Now, the restaurant needs to consider quality of the entire product – food AND service – in setting their prices and delivering to customers. They can no longer say ‘bad servers get weeded out by the unlucky customers who get served by them’ (which I think is pathetic), but they have to invest time and effort in finding or training good ones to ensure that all customers get a uniformly good experience.
The owners will pay the servers a PROPER wage, they will perform there duties to the best of their ability without regard to possible tips, they will know more definitely what they will earn, pay will be based on hours worked, it will be properly taxed, everyone should be square. If a customer receives exceptional service, then it is of course still their option to leave a further tip, BUT it is not required.
If a customer receives crap service, then they can complain – to the manager. If bad enough, the manager can decide to discount the base cost if they want to retain the customer. Most likely, it will encourage restaurants to hire better waitstaff. I like that.
And just on a final nitpicking note … for the server who complained that they must pay tax on 10% of their sales – if they receive 15%-20% tips from all their customers, then they are still only paying tax on half of what they are supposed to.
PLEASE – force restauranters to run their businesses well, pay their staff properly, and GET RID OF ‘MANDATORY TIPPING’!
I work behind the bar in a busy nightclub, where I usually won’t stand still for more than 10 seconds at a time during my 5 hour shift. Due to the crowds you’ll often have to wait for around 5-10 minutes to get served. If you tip, and I know it, chances are I’ll serve you before someone that doesn’t. I’ll also probably be happy to take orders from your friends at the back of the queue and to make cocktails and drinks that aren’t on the menu. I wouldn’t do this for someone who never tips.
My manager wouldn’t care if you complained, quite a few have, because I still make them a lot of money from the people I choose to serve.
Might seem like a strange concept, but tipping is important in some environments.
This is for jeff who wrote on February 28th: You said that “anyone can do your job”. I’d love for you to try being a waiter. I used to think the very SAME THING until I decided to try it out 10 years ago when I lost my office job after our company closed down and I had heard waiters made great money (I lived in Miami Beach, FL where the service industry is numero uno) so I did. I did it for 5 years and finally had enough of it. Not only is it exhausting being on your feet for 8 hours a day (trust me, you have no idea until you try it) but you don’t feel like doing anything after you get home but sleep. Every waiter I knew suffered from constant exhaustion! Now, I know you will say its OUR FAULT for choosing such a profession. Well, to most of us, it’s NOT a career.. it is merely a stepping stone to greater things, such as being a college student and wanting a job that will give you the flexibility to remain a student (most companies will NOT work with your school schedule, just ask Walmart) or already having a “real job”, as you call it, but take on waiting tables to supplement the family income. I can think of many other scenarios in which people choose to wait tables. Waiters generally make a lot of money (even including the cheapskates who choose not to tip) we still make good money. I knew waiters who worked 20 hours to 30 hours a week who brought home 600 dollars a week or more (bartenders boasted about making 200 to 400 a night). Waiters have to not only serve you and refill your drinks constantly and shuffle around for hours and carry LARGE trays of food to your table (let’s see you balance 50 to 100 lbs of food on one hand, dumbass!), clear your table then refill your drink again and again and at the end of the shift, have to do side jobs (yes… bet you didn’t know about that!). There are times that I wish we would increase the price of a meal just to include the server’s salary. It would guarantee that servers get paid 10 to 15 bucks an hour… not to mention, it would prevent cheapskates from coming to restaurants, but I think it ultimately would hurt the industry because less people will want to come out to eat. I can see it now: My server’s service sucked and he spent all night talking to his coworkers and gossiping with customers instead of refilling my glass and I STILL HAVE TO pay for the price of this expensive meal and my waiter will STILL get paid!! I’d rather have my server earn it. If his service sucks, his tip will be less. If he does a great job, I will tip him extra AND let him know how well he did personally (they all appreciate that). I just get the impression that if servers weren’t tipped anymore, that they won’t actually care about providing good service anymore. I mean, if I was guaranteed 20 bucks an hour for being a server, I could care less if you waited too long for a refill honestly or that I didn’t have a smile when i first greeted you: I AM STILL GETTING PAID!! Since the system is as it is and tipping is expected for now, just do it. If you don’t feel like tipping, take it up with the legislators, restaurant industry, restaurant managers, form a petition, form a protest, but please DON’T TAKE IT OUT ON US SERVERS. And Jeff, this is to you: if you don’t feel like tipping, go to a buffet and serve yourself, dumbass.
qq more please. ur job is not that hard
fyi: i don’t tip or tip only a small amount because there are more people who deserve my money than you high school failures
Go back to playing WOW dork.
@admin
I would much, MUCH rather have it be included in the price of menu items, with the actual cost of service completely abstracted away from the customer. I think this is the case for most customers, and I don’t understand why serving staff would believe they would want otherwise.
This would make it simpler for everyone and prevent discrimination against employees in the service industry because of their race or appearance. It also stops restaurants from being able to hide the true costs of their menu items when a customer is ordering (much the same concept as how VAT must be included in South Africa when showing prices). People should not feel obligated to tip, the arguments you list more speak against this kind of an institutionalized voluntary-obligatory tipping custom than for it.
Although I understand that some people may prefer the riskier notion of propositioning tips than a more reliable one of a higher wage, this is awkward and inefficient. If you think about it in terms of rational behavior in regards to pricing and service, nobody should be paying any tips (or eating at restaurants at all due to how much more cheaply you can just make a sandwhich). The utility of a restaurant meal is in being able to relax and enjoy it, usually with company. The social obligation of a tip is stressful (especially for foreigners) and introduces uncertainty for everyone involved since servers will feel slighted for not getting a tip and people will feel cheated for having to give them or feel frightened over not knowing the correct amount.
I do not feel that restaurants should only be visited by rich customers who can afford to splurge as a show of social status, even if the menu looks affordable from outside. The idea of the obligatory voluntary promotes this.
I do not feel that the ugliness of an employee should impose upon him or her a cut in pay compared to a prettier employee. Alas, this is deeply ingrained in our society, tipping just makes it especially blatant.
The notion of voluntary but not really voluntary service charges is mind-boggling. The government should mandate that sales tax be included in prices too. This whole practice of levying hidden costs is slimy to begin with. The toxic attitude toward people who are oblivious or simply opposed to these sorts of complex social games is a consequence of the deeply flawed system that was imposed in the first place.
Employees who are good at soliciting tips win from this scheme, and it helps managers raise their revenues by allowing them to slight the ones that aren’t. If you want this to be an expected custom, you should just put it on the price tag and get it done with, and let your customers relax. They seem perfectly willing to pay for the food, after all, and the people who will be put off by the price rise are the same stingy people who aren’t supposed to be eating there in the first place.
Barend,
Well… since this was a direct response to me… I don’t know what world you live in, but in mine, things are not always fair – well at least they don’t appear to be. I am seriously amazed that you would rather pay 20% more for your dinning experience no matter what kind of service you get. Don’t get me wrong – as a server I’d be all for it, but as a consumer – NO WAY! What if I get slow inattentive service? What if I get a cold meal? What if I get food that has seen a better day on my plate? If the tipping process stresses you out, simply leave 20% and worry not. As the founder of Tip20, I can’t and won’t do this as I feel servers need to earn their tips. They are not free or guaranteed. As a consumer I like to be able to gauge my tip.
The way you speak about it seriously just sounds like another way to give up freedom/power to the government.
Why not just have free everything… Imagine how great service would be at the auto mechanic, doctors office, restaurant if everyone got paid the same NO MATTER WHAT. Trust me you would still seek out the better service. That is the system we have in place. I would still prefer an alternative to the federal reserve dollar, but, I’ll save that for another discussion.
(As a big aside – the admin is a big proponent of the Venus project. Read up and support this cause! – no tipping in that world!)
@admin
I do not think not leaving a tip sends any kind of signal that I have received bad service in practice. Nor should you really need to give that power to customers directly, if I receive bad service I do not need to keep eating there. Businesses that ask for my feedback directly with a card to fill out tend to get it from me, and to me that seems like a much better way to do give feedback than a tip. Plus, if I cut my tip for bad service, I may be punishing people (including the server) that did their job well while other factors did not, or incorrectly judging their performance due to not understanding their situation.
Gratuity and taxes combined can hit a third again the original price. This is ridiculous (although any hidden costs are ridiculous, really) and inefficient, since people ordering off the menu won’t have price information and the behavioral signals associated with it readily available to them in advance. The only people who would benefit from this are the employers making extra money off of customers spending more while under this illusion, and even they may have something to fear from this, more on that straight below.
Tips can should be used as voluntary signals for exceptional service, and themselves be exceptions. In any obligatory setting, they are perverse incentives. If used as a measure of performance, the customer is being incentivized to under-report performance, and servers will be aware of that and will have good reason to suspect that any customer who reported poor performance was lying. Due to the fact that servers are not incentivized to render good service to people who don’t tip (if what is being said here is true, they can actually lose money on these customers), employers will need to worry about them alienating patrons who would still make money for the employer. This is a way to actively incentivize staff to perform worse than they would normally.
Do we really need this sort of perverse incentive? Regardless of the job, if you are paid well, wouldn’t you have a greater desire to keep your job and thus more desire to excel in it? Wouldn’t this hold for any job? If your boss sees a lot of negative feedback about you, wouldn’t he single you out for replacement? Why do you want to give your customers a financial incentive to say you did a bad job even if they do not really think so?
Clearly, customary tips are insane except for people who are cheating the system to begin with. There does not seem to be any good way to get rid of it in the US though. I’ve read of one movement that supposed to be a revolution against tipping. These “don’t tip” people that I’ve been reading about don’t make much sense to me because they make the life of servers worse while still enriching the bosses complicit to this customary gratuity culture. En masse, perhaps they could cause enough havoc to make a difference, but it’d be done indirectly by angering service workers until they need to demand the encoding of customary gratuity into actual, mandatory service charges (I support flat service charges on tables and built in ones on menu items that are more difficult for the staff). Given that these workers have little bargaining power, I think that this is a very weak approach and will do more harm than good.
An ouright boycott is easier for me to stomach: rely on places like Fred Meyer and Starbucks where tipping is not customary but you can still find hot, prepared food and tables. Perhaps a change of experience and a drop in quality, but personally it will not make much difference to me. I think I will take this on when not in company, now that I have a better understanding of the issues around tipping in the American service industry (I live in the US now, after all). Of course, I don’t expect to make a difference myself, but there are other more personal incentives to do with keeping the wallet fatter while trying to thin out other parts, so I may as well give it a run.
I would imagine that being allowed to see the price of the meal (with gratuity) up front would be a fine stopgap in lieu of a better solution; this could be done with minimal effort given the right preparations, the trouble would be about getting people used to that sort of thing.
Finally, since I mentioned it, Starbucks seems to do very well for their workers despite not benefiting from any kind of tipping custom. I suppose that is one of the perks of having 4 dollar coffee, but people still buy it despite that.
You raise interesting points Barend, well said too.
It is interesting to me how everyone seems to assume set wage = bad service in the wait industry. It seems to me, however, in many minds a set wage creates comfort knowing how much you will earn AND knowing you will earn it at every pay period without fail. Many people find that to be satisfactory and reason enough to do a good job. It is true other benefits can come from doing an exceedingly good job, but those bonus are that — bonuses. People in industries set up to receive bonuses still get a living wage at the outset.
I honestly believe everyone needs a living wage whether they give crappy service or not. All sorts of things can factor into why a server serves poorly at any given time. If the service is consistently poor I would suspect the person will not remain employed. I think in the end all people in whatever services should be paid a living wage, and any extra should come on top of that living wage. Being able to make ends meet should not be contingent upon the generosity of others because not everyone is generous. Additionally, people should not be mandated to be generous! Generosity is a matter of the heart.
IMNSHO, people who make $600-$1000/wk because they are servers probably just don’t want to see regulated wages because they wouldn’t be making bank anymore. I have a salary and it is not that high. Furthermore, my salary is in a service industry, I provide DIRECT services, and I don’t get tips.
Freddy either can’t read or didn’t read this article. Mr. Server does NOT get minimum wage, they get a wage which is generally less than $3 an hour. The problem with most people like Freddy is that they don’t realize how much more they will have to pay if restaurants started paying servers a wage commensurate with what they are already making an hour…then come back and complain about service.
I am a fantastic tipper. Mostly because I vividly remember my young tender years working as a busboy/barback, waiter, and finally bartending. This being said, tipping proponent’s arguments are circular bull.
You expect me to tip because I enjoy a full drink, fast service and hot food. You justify this desire by claiming that your hourly wage is too low. Seems to me that you should take up this conflict of interest with your employer, rather than the consumer.
You see, when I go out to eat, I expect the privileges servers list as signs of exceptional service. I come for a dining experience as whole, so if the food or the service were subpar, I will simply not come back. This is a dilemma for the business, if there is no revenue stream, the whole business is s.o.l. So the waiting staff that has an attitude, or offers “average” service ends up costing the entire business money. To circumvent this issue, staff needs to be paid a wage that can sustain them and have a reliable customer feedback system that allows managers to know which servers to keep and which ones to let go. It’s not my fault that it’s usually not the case with many restaurants, so I am not going to take any blame for it and have the extra cost of supporting you be automatically passed on to me. As much as food industry sucks to work in, please don’t paint it as some monumental task, waiting tables is not hard, its mindless physical labor – that’s why high school students (and drop outs!) take it as a job.
If you want to make a fair bit of money, don’t be a waiter. But if you are one, make me want to tip you. Your job is going and telling the chef what I said and then bringing it to me. I don’t need you to do that, I can talk to the chef myself and I can get my own food when it’s ready. I also can just ask for a pitcher of water and top off my own drink. I understand the concept and I know it’s easy. If you want a tip, offer a service that is beyond average, bust ass and you will be rewarded. But please don’t tell me I “have” to do it, because it’s some God sent moral obligation.
Al,
As a former waiter, you had me in your corner up until you classified being a waiter as easy and being “mindless” work that any idiot (not your words, but that is what it comes across as sounding) can do it. I also disagree that it is mostly high school drop outs and those not pursuing college degrees as the ones seeking these jobs. I can’t believe you actually waited tables and have these warped views on the profession. I do agree that it’s about time waiters get paid a regular wage, so that we are always guaranteed a wage regardless if it was a busy day (bad weather… no tips) or we got stiffed a couple times from a big table (few people realize this but just not getting tipped appropriately from a couple of large tables and that can make or break your week, earnings-wise) or having that one regular customer who insists on sitting in a table for 4 and hogs it up for an hour. With a good livable wage, we wouldn’t have to worry about all that. There is one down side to that: Tipped jobs are the few jobs that college students seek out (and Al, you forgot to mention this but there are thousands of waiters in the U.S. who are also pursuing a college education!). The reason why is because it doesn’t interfere with their college studies and they get paid a good deal of money and work less hours than if they had to work retail. As a returning college student who is in his 40s and who was once a career waiter, I can attest that most of the ones who worked with me were college students and I will tell you why: It’s hard enough being a full time student taking 15 credits a semester and then having to make ends meet by taking a part time job. The reason we take part time jobs is because full time jobs can definitely take away from our studies. Being a college student IS like working full time. Mostly everyone knows that it’s hard (not impossible, but hard) to juggle a full time job and full time school. As a non-traditional college student, I soon realized that even if I took out the maximum student loans and grants that cover tuition and living expenses (rent)… I’d still have to take a part time job to cover other misc. expenses such as food, gas, utilities. Al, you make it seem like we take waiter jobs because we want to and most of the time, especially for college students, it’s because WE HAVE TO. We could either work 25 hours a week at Walmart and make shitty money or work 25 hours a week at Applebee’s and make 3 times what Walmart pays!! Waiting tables can be great money (you make it seem like waiters make shitty money) if you work at a top notch restaurant. You suggest that if we want to make great money, we shouldn’t be waiters. Let me tell you… I was a waiter in Miami Beach for 10 years and I made a lot more money than most of my friends who worked “normal jobs”, such as retail (The Gap) and I worked less hours. I could have made a heck a lot more if I had the guts to move up to a classier restaurant, (such as Joe’s Stone Crab), as it was common knowledge that those waiters made from 500 to 1000 a week during season. So don’t make assumptions about waiter salaries.
Second of all, waiting tables it NOT easy work. It seems like easy work to outsiders (which makes me question what kind of waiter you were, if you truly WERE one), because EVERY TIME I worked (as well as my coworkers), I was so pooped at the end of the day, that I had to go home and crawl into bed for a nap because I couldn’t stand up anymore. If I had plans that evening with friends, I always made sure I napped. Most other times, I had to turn down invites to hang out because I was just plain tired. We had to be on our feet 8 hours a day, walk back and forth with heavy plates on a huge tray constantly (we were waiters as well as food runners), and make sure that our patrons were taken care of. I was a damn great waiter and got nothing but compliments from my patrons. Maybe you have seen those waiters at Applebee’s occasionally jabbering with their coworkers with smiles on their faces so maybe you assume they aren’t tired or that they are having fun, but it’s NOT fun work. It can be socially rewarding as you meet people and you develop a camaraderie with your fellow waiters, but it is NOT fun work. It is hard. And at the end of the day, just when you can’t take any more, you have to do side work (fill up ketchup bottles, condiments, salad dressings). I worked in retail before becoming a waiter and working at Barnes and Noble was “easy” work. Working at a supermarket as a cashier was “easy” work. Every retail job I have had was a lot easier than Waiting tables. Nothing compares to waiting tables as far as physical exhaustion and manual labor is concerned!!! So don’t make it seem like it is meaningless. I am still surprised you say you were a waiter. I find that hard to believe, as you sound exactly like the people above who have written before comments putting down waiters as low lives who think they deserve a good tip for merely bringing them their food and drinks, as if that is all we do. It IS NOT.
I am a third year college student and this will be my first degree. I decided after working in retail and customer service jobs all my life that I didn’t want to do that anymore and get a career doing something I enjoy at this point in my life. Customer service positions are grueling and in my late 30s, I finally wanted no part of it anymore. You can get burned out easily. The interesting thing is that when I went back to school, I almost considered working as a waiter because of the hours and flexibility and the pay. My major (industrial design) is very time consuming as the projects involve a lot of man-power and time, so I thought I should go back to waiting tables, as I could work a lot less hours and still make good money. But in the end… I decided to take a on-campus library position as a clerk at 8 bucks an hour, 25 hours a week. I don’t make much and even with all my student loans, I still struggle every month, but I would rather pick my eyes out with a ice pick than ever wait tables again!!!
That’s how much I came to hate it. You know why? It’s the great waiters who get you EVERYTHING you could want and give you excellent service who end up getting stiffed most of the time. You say we should bust our asses and most of us did (yes, there were slackers in my restaurant but they didn’t last long) and even then, we weren’t guaranteed a good tip or a tip at all! There is no worse feeling than getting a great vibe from a table, even a smile from the patron/s, busting your ass, making sure they are refilled constantly and that they are not in need of anything and when you open up that black wallet laying on the table after the patron has gone to find out that you have been stiffed… even when you did nothing wrong. So I’d rather make less money at my laid back, stress-free library job with a guaranteed salary than work so hard and not be always be guaranteed a tip. The only way a guaranteed steady wage for waiters would be appealing to us college students is if it paid minimum 15 dollars per hour. Anything less than that is not even worth it. But I’d love to see you complain when your meals go up in price.
Former Waiter,
You bring up good points about waiting, but you are not making strong arguments. My argument that passing the cost to the consumer for the salary your employer should pay you is not my problem, its yours. Furthermore, you yourself agreed that working a library job with a salary, is nicer than waiting tables – a choice that you’ve made and a job that you made possible. So if people make a choice to not wait tables, but rather get a different, salary position (tons of them around, especially in a college setting); the food industry employers will be forced to make a change.
What is unfortunate about your post is that you firmly believe that waiting is extraordinarily difficult, if not the most difficult job out there. I challenge you to reread what you wrote some years from now when you finish college, go to grad school to get a doctorate (while working through all of those years) and work for a few years in an industry where the labor is purely mental. You’ll wish you could go back to waiting. Waiting seems so hard for you now because you don’t know any better yet. Please, don’t take anything I say offensively, because I am not trying to offend you. I respect all labor and laborers, there is no shame in hard work whether it be digging a ditch, or running a firm. It’s just with physical labor, you can leave and leave the job behind, until you comeback the next day. With mental labor, you are always working – day and night; it’s really difficult to just “let go” and forget about what you’re doing. With physical labor you can stumble back in, sleep deprived, possibly hung over and grind another 12hrs out. It won’t feel pleasant, but its doable. With mental work it is simply not an option.
Again, if I said something to offend you, or any poster on this forum, it was not my intent. Rather, I want to show you that with more knowledge comes more responsibility and actually harder work. Don’t be mistaken, a person that makes a 6-7 figure income, often times (not always of course) is working way harder than any waiter.
So, after waiting for a number of years and moving on to other things and life; I can actually compare side by side what it’s like. As hard as waiting is, there is way worse; and you never get paid enough for the effort you’ve put in.
Former Waiter,
It seems from your post you equate hard and physically taxing. Waiting tables is definitely physically grueling, no doubt about it. That said, I don’t see the physical demands of waiting tables as making it a more difficult job. The mental drain of a job can be much more unbearable than the physical drain. I would add to that the social drain of a job can really take a toll. I see that aspect of waiting as much more of a challenge for certain. I see it as much easier to carry a tray of food and refill water than to engage people in a short time frame in a way that suggests to them you are a good person who is interested in making their dining experience a pleasurable one. Add to that the pressure to “perform” in order to get a pay off at the end and even more stress is created. If all I have to do is show up, carry heavy stuff, refill some condiments, play filler as necessary (sweep, mop, etc.), my body will be PRESSED, but my mind will be able to rest possibly without the anxiety of continued social/mental responsibility after my shift ends.
Now, to dismiss all that I’ve said, I will state I have never waited a day in my life. I have, however, worked in a cafeteria and on some levels I am sure similarities exist between that and waiting. I just got no tips for serving — or cleaning up after people when they should have been doing it themselves. (I guess some of them didn’t care enough to be responsible nor did they feel compelled to tip me for exceeding service expectations.)
Why is it the consumers responsibility to have to pay the employees of the place he patronizes? I’ve never understood this and have never agreed with it. I’m underpaid in my profession and I don’t receive tips for going “above and beyond” what’s expected out of me. If I’m not happy where I’m working, I’m free to quit my job and find something that pays more. I am so sick to death of being expected to tip: waiters, waitresses, hairdressers, bartenders, bellmen, cab drivers, etc, etc, etc. Hell, even people tip the kids at McDonald’s in the drive-thru. What a joke! If people would collectively refuse to tip a waitress or waiter in a restaurant, it would force management to pay their employees a decent wage or else they would lose their workforce.
Let me just say this…I DO tip waiters. I, personally, think that if a waiter does a great job that they should be paid their 15% or more depending on the quality. However, I do not pay the FULL 15% to bad waiters. Though I do pay, it’s usually a bit less like 10%. My reasoning is, I’m not going to pay the same for crappy service as I do to someone who gave me great service. Why should I give them the full? Because it is REQUIRED? Because they EXPECT it? No. I have several family members in this business and they agree if a waiter gives bad service, don’t give them the full percentage. Give them a tip, unless they did a painfully obvious BAD job (like dropped your food in your lap, didn’t attend you at all, mouthed off or whatever), but if they weren’t great but still did their job half right, give them at least something. They may get upset, but I look at it as “You want to earn your full tips? Try harder.” They can call me cheap or argue with me, but I pay what I think they deserve, (never do I leave no tips) and if I were in their shoes and I did bad quality service, I would not expect to be paid the same in tips as someone who went above and beyond.
I tip for good (when I’m home)and the service is REALLY great on each visit.
When travling (and wont be back)if the servise lousy NO tip whatsover. A few times left a note on a paper napkin explaining the reason.
Oh, I hear all the time about snootyness of servers when fine dinning. WTF, that’s like the “help” are running the show. No tip ever for those and too bad for them!
The only time I “tip” is if the meal something like $49.59, $29.23, $39.81, something like that. I don’t want to wait for change so they will get the rest of the change that make up a dollar. Otherwise they get a thank you and have a nice day.
The reason I do not tip is because I don’t think one should tip someone for doing their job. It is their job to make sure your glass is full, your food is good, your food is what you ordered. They shouldn’t be tipped for that. My parents own a delivery business and I don’t get money tips. I may get a free soda, or slice of pizza, or a sub but not money. If I don’t get a tip I don’t frown, I actually don’t expect tips and try to tell people no.
Do FedEx drivers get tipped? No. Do truck drivers get tips? No. Do mail carriers get tips? No. Do cashiers get tips? No. So why do food industry employees believe they are entitled to my money?
People often say that servers don’t make very much. I don’t know of any server that is forced into that job. If they would like more pay they can most certainly leave and find another job. Something people don’t know is that if a server doesn’t make up their lack of pay in tips the restaurant has to pay them enough to make it minimum wage. If the server made $100 less than they would have if they were on minimum wage their boss has to pay them that money by law.
I don’t feel guilty not leaving a tip. Maybe the servers hate me and speak ill of me. I am very polite to them and treat them how I want to be treated. I just don’t believe I should make up for their lack of pay just because they choose to be a server.
“Do FedEx drivers get tipped? No. Do truck drivers get tips? No. Do mail carriers get tips? No. Do cashiers get tips? No. So why do food industry employees believe they are entitled to my money?”
God. I. Am. So. Sick. Of. People. Saying. This.
When was the last time any of those people catered to every stupid whim of yours for an hour and a half? They are not entitled, you supposed to APPRECIATE it.
p.s. servers do hate you, luckily, your not there anymore to notice.
Melvin
First of all, delivery people get paid a regular salary. Most states don’t pay their waiters minimum wage. Some states do, like MN, where waiters here make min. wage PLUS tips, but in Florida, where I was a waiter for 5 years, we got paid 2 bucks an hour PLUS tips. And if it rained or business was slow that day for whatever reason… our employer did NOT pay us the difference. Are you insane? Where did you get that from? Maybe in YOUR state but definitely not in Florida. And why do waiters do this sort of work? Melvin, have you ever been a college student? Have you? If not, then YOU WOULD NOT UNDERSTAND why waiters do what they do.
Most college students I know work as waiters because its extremely flexible work. When you are a student, you need an employer that can work with your class schedule (most employers don’t) and also you get to work half as much hours and get paid the same as working full time. Does that make sense? Why bother working at Walmart if you have to work 40 hours a week to earn what you would working part-time at Applebee’s ? Most students can’t work 40 hours without their grades suffering. At my school, our advisors always tell students NOT to work 40 plus hours because it will put a dent in our studies and it does. Trust me.
Most of us students still need to make a living while attending school and waiting tables does pay well… for those that tip us well. If you don’t want to tip, Melvin… then I suggest you get up and get the food your ordered from the kitchen and refill your glass every time you go out to eat at a restaurant. The comparison between a FedEx guy and a waiter is not even close!! Yes, we waiters are doing our job and we shouldn’t have to expect a tip but if our employers don’t pay us minimum wage, then we SHOULD get tipped IF…… AND ONLY IF….. we did a good job and made your dining experience enjoyable. If it wasn’t, I am not advocating leaving a tip, but a suggestion for the waiter on how lousy he was. Take it out with the manager too.
By the way, it’s not just college students who wait tables. Single moms do it too because of the hours (most can’t work full time), etc. There are many reasons people choose to work as waiters. The money truly IS good.
Melvin, bad tippers such as yourself are in the minority. Most of the patrons I waited on had no problem tipping me well, because I paid extra attention to them. The reason for tipping is to ensure that you are being treated well. A FedEx person is not waiting on your every whim, especially when you keep asking for more refills or this and that every 5 seconds. The FedEx man delivers your package, period…. he doesn’t paint your house or take out your garbage too or throw in a back rub either. A waiter waits on your nasty ass for a half to a full hour and you have the balls to not leave a tip? How despicable. I suggest, since you despise waiters so much, why don’t you just cook your own food and stay home and serve yourself? If you know that waiters get paid so little, why take it out on them??? WTF. No woman in their right mind would date a cheapo like you. Ugh.
PS- I don’t think I would ever want tipping to be eradicated. When I go eat out… if my waiter sucks and spends his/her time gossiping with the rest of the staff or bullshitting instead of watching over my table and cater to my needs, then his tip suffers. MOST professional waitstaff (those who value their profession) know better than ignore their tables or treat our customers like crap. We know that our tip depends on our friendly service and prompt customer service. If I give you GREAT SERVCE… yes, Melvin, it’s MY JOB to do so but…. why take it out on me? Go live in Europe if you hate tipping so much. In the UK and France… the waiters give you the “minimal” customer service… not much, not less. Just enough. I wouldn’t want that here.
PS- Melvin
If you are that cheap… trust me… next time you go and we waiters remember your cheap ass… your food might just have a secret surprise in it. Like a boogar or spit. I never ever did that to my cheap or rude regular customers, but I knew waiters who licked the food before serving it to the patron.
I am not advocating this type of behavior but just beware. It does happen. Waiters do remember those who stiffed them.
Another suggest, Melvin. Go eat at McDonalds!! As you said… Mcdonald’s employees are DOING THEIR JOBS.. they shouldn’t get tipped. Of course they shouldn’t get tipped. They are just taking your order and taking your money. That’s all. If you were to tell me that the McDonald’s employee is taking your food to your table and refilling your glass every time it empties, then YOU SHOULD TIP! Melvin, it’s common knowledge and courtesy to tip in America. Don’t like it… don’t go out to eat at restaurants. Stick to fast food.
TopCoat
I never said I didn’t appreciate it. I say thank you when i am given a drink and brought my meal. I say please, have a nice day, no thank you, everything else. I just don’t see why I should have to go further than that. I also don’t know what restaurant you’re eating at, but I am usually in and out in under an hour unless the kitchen screws something up.
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